Helicopter registered to Colin McRae reported crashed

[SPX]

Originally Posted by DSM10000

Whilst this report may taint his memory it should not overwrite it and all the other good things he acheived.

I couldn't disagree more.

What could he have done in his life that would counteract killing three innocent people through his own vanity?

[NOMONEYBUTAMERC]

How do you get to be allowed to fly a helicopter without a licence ? Presumably any insurance would also be void.
Unsure about the comments regarding Graham Hill not having qualifications to land in fog , as far as i am aware there are no parking places in the sky where you can wait until the fog clears.

[markjay]

Originally Posted by NOMONEYBUTAMERC

How do you get to be allowed to fly a helicopter without a licence ?..

From the quote in the OP, that bit sound to me like a technicality: '...should not have flown that machine at that time.'. He probably had a license for a similar model of aircraft, or did not renew his old license, or such like.

Not that it is OK to do so, and it may have well been a contributing factor, but by the sound of it this was not really the main issue or the main cause for the crash, rather his recklessness was.

But the significance of this, and the main reason it is frowned upon by responsible aviators, is that someone who is not meticulous regarding such detail as his/her pilot license, is likely to have a cavalier approach to other aspects of flight, ultimately including safety. And in Colin McRae's case, it seems that they were not wrong.

[davidjpowell]

Originally Posted by markjay

From the quote in the OP, that bit sound to me like a technicality: '...should not have flown that machine at that time.'. He probably had a license for a similar model of aircraft, or did not renew his old license, or such like.

Not that it is OK to do so, and it may have well been a contributing factor, but by the sound of it this was not really the main issue or the main cause for the crash, rather his recklessness was.

But the significance of this, and the main reason it is frowned upon by responsible aviators, is that someone who is not meticulous regarding such detail as his/her pilot license, is likely to have a cavalier approach to other aspects of flight, ultimately including safety. And in Colin McRae's case, it seems that they were not wrong.

From a distant memory I think it was to do with currency, i.e. number of hours flown over a set time, nothing to do with make or model of chopper

[BTB 500]

Originally Posted by NOMONEYBUTAMERC

How do you get to be allowed to fly a helicopter without a licence ?

You're not 'allowed to', but you can do it in the same way that you can drive a car without a licence.

Originally Posted by NOMONEYBUTAMERC

Unsure about the comments regarding Graham Hill not having qualifications to land in fog , as far as i am aware there are no parking places in the sky where you can wait until the fog clears.

Without an instrument rating you are only allowed to fly in clear conditions. You are expected to find out what the weather conditions are, and divert somewhere else if necessary.

[clever dicky]

I remember purely by chance finding this report of his crash on the web. It didnt mention him by name but quite obvious. It had quite a large number of pages to it, and I assume its still there available still for anyone to search out. But I do recall as well as the ride for his passengers / kids, he was also carrying a gearbox for a car. Maybe he was in a hurry or it could have rolled lose or something.

It was a while ago and sadly not familiar with HC controls myself, but 'apparently' and this is my recollection and interpretation, it was as if he was aiming the craft at the trees and then tried to pull out at the last minute. I recall there was a very large section on the design of a particular control in question (collector ??) that was not only unable to cope with demands placed on it, but using as it was intended the strength (forces) needed was also beyond the ability of the pilot to do so.

[JohnEBoy]

I wasn't aware this was still ongoing - it's taken nearly 4 years to conclude - is that normal?

[BTB 500]

The full report is on the AAIB website:

http://www.aaib.gov.uk/cms_resources...HL%2002-09.pdf

[oldcro]

I believe his licence had lapsed and had not been renewed prior to the accident.

[DSM10000]

Originally Posted by sweetpea

I couldn't disagree more.

What could he have done in his life that would counteract killing three innocent people through his own vanity?

At no point did I suggest that anyone should forget that his stupiidity cost the lives of three innocent people. No one is suggesting however that this was a deliberate actt, remember that his son was also on board and was killed.

It was reckless, foolhardy and criminally irresponsible but not deliberate.

People do stupid and thoughtless things, mostly we get away with it or the consequences are relatively minor, other times like these we pay dearly for those moments.

[SPX]

Originally Posted by DSM10000

At no point did I suggest that anyone should forget that his stupiidity cost the lives of three innocent people.

Originally Posted by DSM10000

Whilst this report may taint his memory it should not overwrite it and all the other good things he acheived.

That's what it sounded like to me; "it should not overwrite it and all the other good things he achieved".

Yes, i understand that he was a good rally driver, but whatever he achieved in his life pales into insignificance when compared with killing two children and another man through sheer vanity.

I understand your point that people get away with little reckless things from time to time, but would the same compassion be afforded to someone that killed two children while driving a car with no licence to?

[DSM10000]

I am no fan of his nor a detractor, I did not know him nor have I folowed his career. He clearly made an error or series of errors of judgement and he paid for it with his life and that of 3 others. He was certainly guilty of being cavalier with regard to the licencing requirements and ratings checks he was obliged to follow but it was surely just an accident.

Judging him for his actions here is ultimately pointless, learning from them is the only realistic approach.

As for my comment about not overwriting things he had done, well we all hopefully have more things in our lives to be proud of than not and despite our tendancies to make mistakes we can only hope the consequences are never like this.

[SPX]

Originally Posted by DSM10000

Judging him for his actions here is ultimately pointless, learning from them is the only realistic approach.

I hope I don't come across as holier-than-thou and too judgemental because that is not my intention.
I've made some big mistakes myself in my younger years and had to pay a heavy price for them, but I took them on the chin and got on with it because ultimately I knew I'd done wrong.
If Mother Theresa went out and bombed a town killing scores of people, would you forgive her because of all that she's done before that?

[MOCAŠ]

Originally Posted by sweetpea

I hope I don't come across as holier-than-thou and too judgemental because that is not my intention.
I've made some big mistakes myself in my younger years and had to pay a heavy price for them, but I took them on the chin and got on with it because ultimately I knew I'd done wrong.
If Mother Theresa went out and bombed a town killing scores of people, would you forgive her because of all that she's done before that?

Let's maintain a sense of proportion, sweetpea.

DSM1000 has already made the point that however reckless McRae's actions were, they were not deliberately intended to bring harm to those on board. So drawing comparison with an act of atrocity is futile.

However, taking your analogy at face value, while people may well not have been able to forgive her for committing such an act, the question is would it have overwritten all the good she had done.

[jepho]

The 103 page report of the AAIB demonstrated that McRea was to blame for the accident.

I have a son who is currently undergoing ATPL (H) training. Having discussed with him many aspects of chopper flying, it is clear that commercial pilots understand that low flying increases risk... no space to autorotate if one's only engine fails, getting caught in your own downwash, obstacles to hit and no easy escape if the aircraft fails to respond to extreme demands on its power or airframe.

As far as I can tell, choppers should (ideally) always be above 500 feet to create an absolute minimum safety margin. I have been up in several varieties of chopper and I have never flown with a commercial pilot who wanted to fly under 1500 feet.

My son insists that flying a single engined aircraft is an inherently risky thing to do, especially if it is a rotary rather than fixed wing aircraft. The report would suggest that McRae was in some manner showboating (cardinal thing to avoid) and got into difficulty that he had neither the experience nor the luck to escape from. Flying into trees would suggest that trees are serious obstacles which must be avoided at all costs. The lowest recorded height of 155 feet during the flight strongly suggests a blatant disregard for basic safety and a foolish lack of knowledge.

Added to that; the disregard of the normal rules, squawk transponder not set to Mode C and flying while unlicensed with no up-to-date type rating, make it an inevitability that McRae was an accident waiting to happen.

Sad for his loss of life... sadder still for the families of his victims.