v6 vs straight 6

[Copiertech]

the austin princesses had a transverse I6 as well

[Brian WH]

Originally Posted by glojo

I reckon all those that have sited 'space' as being the prime reason are hitting the nail on the head.

The in line 320CDI will not fit into the ML so the 'longest' engine was the 270CDI. This is an in-line 5 cylinder engine compared to the 4 cylinder V8's that are offered. Then with the E-class the 4Matic has not been offered with the 320CDI yet has been available with the 320 V6 petrol. (Only in LHD format).

Regards,
John

I had to wait 6 months for the E Class to be adapted to fit the larger 320 CDI engine into the W211. Its tight as my signature picture shows.

This is why they are now going for V engines as it gives them more space to play with, the engine compartment is easier to work in and the designers have more scope for changes.

[Aswall]

Originally Posted by SeanO

Yes Aswall, that's correct.

But what is this inline-6 that you say it replaced. The only inline-6 I know of that was anywhere near that size was the old 260 which was discontinued in 93.

The E240V6 substituted the E230-4 around 97/98 as far as I remember, on the W210. The E320 inline-6 was replaced with the E320 V6 (the 112 series modular engine).

Am I missing something here?

Pascal

Wasn't me mate, haven't a clue what old Mercs had in them

[mobeyone]

how interesting!!
Now, as the amgs are a v8 kompressor, was there ever a straight 6,8 kompressor for high end performance? or woudl this be a eco disaster

Have i made sense?

[pentoman]

Interestingly enough, BMW's new 3.0 255bhp straight six in the 330i, 630i, 730i and probably soon 530i is claimed to be the lightest production six cylinder engine available. That's an impressive claim, especially as I-6's are usually heavier than V6's.

Impressive, and puts a slight dampener on enthusiasm for the new Mercedes 3.5 24-valve engine, competent though that is.



The I-6 in the current M3, however, is a cast iron unit that is very heavy (not far off a V8).


Russ

[mercs600]

I have had various 'sixes' over the years - MB's,BMW's,Ford's,Vauxhalls etc - in my experience there has been no different in power or 'smoothness' - only in reliability!All the V6's have had to have engine strip downs for various reasons whilst the inlines were absolutely bullet proof! I may be mistaken but I would prefer an inline over a 'V' anyday!I wonder if MB are going to go back to inlines just as they are dropping the 3 valve cylinder heads and reverting back to 4 valves?

[calum]

Originally Posted by anarchy-inc

Ever tried changing the spark plugs on an inline-6?

We had to remove the head on my old Jag XJ6C (I-6), the day before a driving holiday to France, because I stupidly snapped off a spark plug

Nice engines, those...

[SeanO]

Aswell, I was just ageeing with your figures.

It was the statement RE. 'inline-6 being replaced by V6-240', made by MB240 that has lost me.

[JimMac]

I am a simple person, V6's are ideal for short wide installations and straights for long narrow.

Tractors have straight sixes because they need long and narrow. Dozers can have v's because they tend to be wide. Cars can have either dependent on widths between strut turrets etc and v angle be it 60 or 90.

Multiples of three are inherently smooth with lots of stuff to do with crankshaft harmonics etc, torsional vibration dampers and all sorts of other lovely stuff. Above V12 the harmonics etc stop being sutch an issue so V16 engines dont have balancer shafts but will have weighted timing gears etc.

W engines haven't been discussed yet, but they are creeping into the luxury sector. perhaps merc will go the whole hog and fit a radial lump.

But I love merc's V6 it is smooth when needed but sounds great above and beyond 4000 as did my previous bmw with its straight six. Three cylinder corsa's etc also sound nice when thrashed. Four cylinders are fine if they have balancer shafts but the majority of car manufacturers don't bother. Whereas Merc and most commercial diesel firms do. Its not just for a smooth drive but also to extend durability, reducing low hour fatigue issues, less complex engine mounts required etc.

Its all lovely stuff. What a great thread.

JimMac. frustrated ex plant mechanic.

[peterchurch]

Originally Posted by mercs600

I have had various 'sixes' over the years - MB's,BMW's,Ford's,Vauxhalls etc - in my experience there has been no different in power or 'smoothness' - only in reliability!All the V6's have had to have engine strip downs for various reasons whilst the inlines were absolutely bullet proof! I may be mistaken but I would prefer an inline over a 'V' anyday!I wonder if MB are going to go back to inlines just as they are dropping the 3 valve cylinder heads and reverting back to 4 valves?

The only way you could do really say this for sure isto drive the _same_ car with a V and an I engine then comapre the two for their finer points...

The MB 320 I6 was notorious for blowing head gasgets, but were nice to work on. But I can also state that for the 320 I6 vs the 320 v6 is a world of difference as the I6 with its more power had a flat spot in the middle of the acceleration range. While the V6 (less power by 10 hp) is smooth and constant all the way, but then again it is 50KG or more lighter than the I6 so whats faster, +10HP or -50Kg ???

[tim.mcd]

Originally Posted by peterchurch

The MB 320 I6 was notorious for blowing head gasgets, but were nice to work on. But I can also state that for the 320 I6 vs the 320 v6 is a world of difference as the I6 with its more power had a flat spot in the middle of the acceleration range. While the V6 (less power by 10 hp) is smooth and constant all the way, but then again it is 50KG or more lighter than the I6 so whats faster, +10HP or -50Kg ???

I owned two high mileage BMW's, safe in the knowledge that if I blew a head gasket, there was only the one to replace and it could be done with the engine in the car (E32 with M30 engine )

This wasn't quite bangernomics, but close to it!

[Ian B Walker]

Originally Posted by anarchy-inc

Ever tried changing the spark plugs on an inline-6?

Easy with the right tools 20 mins max

[glojo]

Trivia on different Mercedes-Benz engines

I think the old 280E (1983) Had an inline 6 cylinder engine that developed 185bhp at 5800rpm if that is any use.

While I'm at it with all this useful information.

The first inline six cylinder Mercedes-Benz engine I can find is in the 28/95 range the Sport Phaeton of 1922 had a 7.2ltr 90bhp engine

First V engine I have found is...
A Daimler Stahlradwagen Made in the same year Brian was born 1889!!
a V2 565cc developing 1.5bhp at 920rpm

Hitlers staff car had the inline 8 cylinder engine 7.6ltr 230bhp 3200rpm

An inline 8 cylinder engine also went into the first SLR the 1955 300SLR = 310bhp at 7400rpm

The first V6 engine I can find is for the 1996 C-class AMG 2.5ltr 500bhp at 11500rpm!!!

1997 saw the V6 320 engine 224bhp at 5600rpm

These figures are all obtained from a reference book my son bought me and are written in German so there may well (read probably) be some discrepancies. That is my attempt at a disclaimer

Regards,
John the Anarok

[anarchy-inc]

Originally Posted by Ian B Walker

Easy with the right tools 20 mins max

Due to the size of the engine bay on the 280, reaching the back plug near the firewall was not easy with my short arms. Tools were not the issue!!!!

[anarchy-inc]

Originally Posted by glojo

The first inline six cylinder Mercedes-Benz engine I can find is in the 28/95 range the Sport Phaeton of 1922 had a 7.2ltr 90bhp engine

Wow, 7.2L and only 90bhp, really shows how things have developed since then.